Patch v118 Feedback

[Nanami]

Firstly, I want to thank you for all your hard work in continuing to update this server for Eden as it has been my favorite and imo the best server of all of the eden servers thus far, so for that I thank you for all your dedication on patches @Jordan.

As a long-term player of this server for many consistent years, I'd like to just give my feedback on the latest patch. I am in NO WAY complaining about anything, I merely making some suggestions that I truly hope finally reach unlike any of my other suggestions.  
Lv125 Armor/Awakened Armor Sets As A Whole:
I believe that it would be more beneficial to especially newcomers but older players as well if you would decrease the total amount of Abyssal Essences needed for an entire set. As it stands currently we need 39 of any of the Lv115 dungeon essences just to make the set gold and after that we must collect another 39 to craft tablets for awakening tablets as a material, but to top it off we must collect another 90 to enhance new essences; making the grand total 168.

Current total cost needed for 1 set should roughly be:
Abyssal Soul x830
Frosty Essence x10
Vicious Essence x10
Shocking Essence x10
Abyss Head Armor Fragment x18
Abyss Body Armor Fragment x18
Abyss Waist Armor Fragment x18
Abyss Hand Armor Fragment x18
Abyss Foot Armor Fragment x18
Abyssal Essence x56 (Needs 168 of any abyss essence)
Fragmented Abyssal Souls x1000
This is everything needed to go from an orange Lv123 set to a fully awakened set (material cost).

I'd ultimately like to ask that the cost of abyssal essences be reduced per enhanced essence or the cost of essences needed to make abyssal essences be reduced. With the current drop rate of essences and even with farming multiple characters a day, it'll roughly be a month to awaken 1 set from 0 essences to 168. 

Partial Enchant Box Lv9: 
My final suggestion is that the cost of these be lowered to 25 souls each and can be obtained on drops from the new deep abyss dungeons. It's kind of (really imo) unfair to people who want to do sets and achievements to have to choose 1 or the other, not to mention on release of Lv8 when they were brand new and a far bigger stat jump than Lv7s they dropped on bosses.

Lv8 boxes are also purchasable for 5 tokens per box with a maximum of 40 coins obtained per day in 1 character, unlike souls where we on average gain roughly 30 a day. 

I'd also like to ask that you yet again take a look at the last two suggestion posts and truly consider some of the QoL suggestions, we're long overdue for anything QoL and quite frankly, I will be honest.
People are quitting, people are tired of grindy content, no QoL, just stuff that we HAVE to farm daily and if we miss something we're super set back. It's exhausting to have to be in this loop.  Thanks for reading, good luck with all your future endeavors, take care and happy new year. 

[banluysrul]

good

[Perroempapado]

Hi o3o/
So it has been a while since the patch v115 and v118-v119 update, roughly a month since the latter. Thus I believe that there are thing to be adressed, well more like reinforced, about the amount of farming that needs to be done to be "geared". Consider this post as a suggestion please. Since english is not my main language kindly do forgive/take in to account some lack of tact and some grammatical errors that might be within this post.

Deep Abyss:

Awaken Sets:
In regards to the Lv125 sets, just as Amaris has said in their feedback, the main issue here is the insane amount of normal abyss essences since we need x168 Abyss essences to get to an awakened set starting one from zero. Sure I can understand the x39 for tablets making the golden and said tablets to be a material for awakenning set since it's a rather usual mechanic and it does give the feeling of awakening said set. So in my opinion the problem lies on the x90 Abyss essences that are needed to enhance the new ones. Considering that drops are RNG, let's take a look at the time needed to gather the already mentioned essences.

In average we get 3 Abyss essences per day, making the collection of the x90 needed to take around a 3 months, now in the best case scenario we could gather alt the materials in 2 months. in my opinion this is an insane amount of time to get one set. Plus to really be geared, one player "needs" to have at least 3 of the best sets at the moment rpds, pdps, mdps (not considering heal since there is no dmg decrease in having a 115 Abyss set) thus to be geared it would take anywhere from 6-9 months.
Then my suggestion would be to either

1. Increase the drop rate of essences in normal abyss (maybe 2x?).
2. Lower the amount needed for the enhancement of deep abyss essences from 5x Abyssal to 3x (or to be honest make said bps ask for 10x of Deep Abyss essences and 5x Abyssal).
3. Make it so that putting the Deep Abyss essences in arcane box will give you an Abyssal essence (hopefully 1:1 rate). 

Any of the mentioned, I believe would greatly improve motivation for players to continue going (and for some to even go at all) to deep abyss + abyss.

Partial Enchantments:
In regards to the enchant boxes, I do consider the 60x for one box a bit of an overkill, maybe lower it to 35-45 since that range would allow us to still get some enchants but still not an easy to get amount. plus it would make sense in my opinion to add said boxes as a natural drop from bosses, maybe only 2nd form if it's important to make them particulary rare.

Viridian Gorge:

Now that it has been quite a while since the release of VG, with the new armors we were able to see a bigger influx of players going there (for now) I have a few worries. It is no secret that once top-geared players get the items they want, they will not go to the same place were they got said item from. I mean there is no incentive to, right? Of course this is more of a problem with the player base and not necessarily the design of the dng. But to adress it directly I do believe it is easier to make more accesible mode of VG that is to say a 5-player mode rewards of course can be, and should be, halved in said mode. I genuinly believe this would benefit the player base as a whole, since it would allow us to make the 10-player first and then divide said party into two 5p to get the other entries. And the other issue (minor imo) is the amount of materials needed to get the bp's of said gems, I do beleive these could be lowered a bit (maybe 75 lower).

thats all o/ thanks for reading.

[Jordan]

It is too early to be making nerfs based around people who are new or joining the game being able to catch up. The drop rates where vigorously tested to make sure the sets take an adequate amount of time. Yes this will be decreased in future but what you have to remember what are people going to be doing in a months time when they max everything?

I will look into the Abyssal Essence situation and make sure my calculations where right but I believe they are.

As for Viridian Gorge I will quote my previous reply to this as it still stands aside from the guilds mentioned you can just swap out for the most current guilds.

Quote

The dungeon allows for 10 players but the HP and such was designed for around 6 - 7 players. We did this to try and be more inclusive of the community so inviting people who maybe aren't really geared enough or aren't strong enough to have a huge impact isn't a waste of a party slot. This is probably the single most biggest in the game right now for new players who don't join Garden or Stardust. I have spent time talking with people who have just started or returned to the game and saw there struggles to get anything done. So atleast in this dungeon it won't hurt you to fill out your party with a couple of randoms who just want to play the game.

This content is designed to last and because of how the rates are designed you cant often get high drop values compared to the older tower-esk dungeons. Based on me spending several hours testing and tweaking each gem should 2 days of runs if you are on average luck, but from my testing youb will get a lot of high drops through out that. I think 2 days for a high powered gem is perfectly acceptable. However, if you disagree then theres not really anything wrong sticking with the DF/4T gems as I tried hard to make these new gems good but not outright replacements, so theres nothing wrong sticking with older stuff if you find it this way.

 

[banluysrul]

good

[Jojolion]

I support the intent of having the regular essence being abysmally high (pun intended) to get new/returning players catch up to the active players right now. 

But... an issue that I'm starting to see right now is the oversupply of Deep Abyss essence because they are essentially unusable until a players gets x139 regular Abyss essence. To counter this, maybe we can get DA essence be arcane-able into Abyssal essence as well for like 5:2 rates?? I'll leave the rate calculations to you.

As for Partial Enchants, I agree with Perro's.

[Hops12]

17 hours ago, Jordan said:

It is too early to be making nerfs based around people who are new or joining the game being able to catch up. The drop rates where vigorously tested to make sure the sets take an adequate amount of time. Yes this will be decreased in future but what you have to remember what are people going to be doing in a months time when they max everything?

Hello, 

I am a part of those returning players who have recently started trying to catch up with the players who have been grinding for these awakened sets for months and months on end. I've also seen a few threads and suggestions people have made regarding the amount needed. I can see why they want it lowered, and also why you would want it to be retained. But maybe it's time to recheck the free time the community has in a month? Yes, people who are able to actively play every day would take a couple of months to complete them which prolongs the lifespan of each patch the GM team rolls out, but does the community still have that much free time? Just looking at it from the point of view of the new player/returning player you refuse to adjust for, it is very intimidating to know that it would take regular players that long and that it would take maybe ten times the duration for us players who can only log on a few times a week? It promotes "account sharing" or just demotivates a person completely because it takes that long to get even just one set (probably a month or so). Of course, I know you have to account for these active players and that decreasing the quantity would mean hastening the time it would take for them to complete the sets.. but what happens when the active players you want to avoid reaching the end game too quickly want to take a break from the grind? It would be old players taking a break from the game and new players with a big obstacle to cross just to even get one set to awaken.

Of course, at the end of the day, I am but one player who just so happens to have returned to the game. It's the GM team's call on how they want to run the game. But maybe it's worth looking at it from the point of view of other than just that the numbers make sense? 

[Jordan]

On 1/27/2024 at 5:40 AM, Hops12 said:

Hello, 

I am a part of those returning players who have recently started trying to catch up with the players who have been grinding for these awakened sets for months and months on end. I've also seen a few threads and suggestions people have made regarding the amount needed. I can see why they want it lowered, and also why you would want it to be retained. But maybe it's time to recheck the free time the community has in a month? Yes, people who are able to actively play every day would take a couple of months to complete them which prolongs the lifespan of each patch the GM team rolls out, but does the community still have that much free time? Just looking at it from the point of view of the new player/returning player you refuse to adjust for, it is very intimidating to know that it would take regular players that long and that it would take maybe ten times the duration for us players who can only log on a few times a week? It promotes "account sharing" or just demotivates a person completely because it takes that long to get even just one set (probably a month or so). Of course, I know you have to account for these active players and that decreasing the quantity would mean hastening the time it would take for them to complete the sets.. but what happens when the active players you want to avoid reaching the end game too quickly want to take a break from the grind? It would be old players taking a break from the game and new players with a big obstacle to cross just to even get one set to awaken.

Of course, at the end of the day, I am but one player who just so happens to have returned to the game. It's the GM team's call on how they want to run the game. But maybe it's worth looking at it from the point of view of other than just that the numbers make sense? 

I would agree with you, but the sets have only been out 1 month and 1 week. I have also checked the data on how many people have completed awaken sets and it is more of less in line with what was expected. I would argue anyone who is logging in now isn't even technically playing catch up?

Also correct me if I'm wrong. But I believe this is the only thread about lowering them? I know theres chatter in game about it but that same chatter happens every patch so it's hard to tell how much is genuine and how much its just someone being angry if they haven't had as many drop as would have liked?

Also I would like to point out that because of the new awakened systems you can start progressing your gear from the moment you get it. So the second you craft the orange version you can already begin fortifying / geming / enhancing etc. These orange sets are in themselves decent enough as a starting set and then when you get the materials to upgrade it you can then continue the progress on the golden set before heading to the awakened set.

So yes it takes maybe 1 month to awaken the armor and "max" it out. But you could login in now, craft the orange set and already have the building blocks and start working on your character. People are far to focused on having to be completely maxed out within days of the patch launching and with the rate in which armors release your looking at this content being able to be spanned across 1-2 years for the dedicated players. So if it takes you 6 months of hard work to get the majority of sets is that not kinda good to have stuff to do while waiting for the next patch when the orange is perfectly viable, the gold is close enough to the awaken.

I mean for example comparing the the first in reverse order awaken heavy mdmg set.

you get set bonus wise
5% more pve dmg across the whole set and -5% pvp dmg taken.
10 more int, 5 more lck
25 more mcrit, 25 pts of acc
3% more mattack, 2% more dmg dealt
(then the best part about the gold is the 5% chance to increase their mdmg taken +5%)

then u compare it to the awaken
another 20 int and 10 lck
max mp 3896, 25 more mcrit and acc and 5% mcrit dmg
5% more mattack, 1% more dmg dealt and the proc becomes 10% chance with 2 stacks and a -252 acc debuff.

So as you can see theres nothing really standout that makes you unable to play the game with starting at the orange version and the second you get gold your more than capable to pvp on it without being at much of any disadvantage.

Idk if I'm missing something but I don't really think the system is unreasonable for brand new content?

[Hops12]

15 hours ago, Jordan said:

I would agree with you, but the sets have only been out 1 month and 1 week. I have also checked the data on how many people have completed awaken sets and it is more of less in line with what was expected. I would argue anyone who is logging in now isn't even technically playing catch up?

Also correct me if I'm wrong. But I believe this is the only thread about lowering them? I know theres chatter in game about it but that same chatter happens every patch so it's hard to tell how much is genuine and how much its just someone being angry if they haven't had as many drop as would have liked?

Also I would like to point out that because of the new awakened systems you can start progressing your gear from the moment you get it. So the second you craft the orange version you can already begin fortifying / geming / enhancing etc. These orange sets are in themselves decent enough as a starting set and then when you get the materials to upgrade it you can then continue the progress on the golden set before heading to the awakened set.

So yes it takes maybe 1 month to awaken the armor and "max" it out. But you could login in now, craft the orange set and already have the building blocks and start working on your character. People are far to focused on having to be completely maxed out within days of the patch launching and with the rate in which armors release your looking at this content being able to be spanned across 1-2 years for the dedicated players. So if it takes you 6 months of hard work to get the majority of sets is that not kinda good to have stuff to do while waiting for the next patch when the orange is perfectly viable, the gold is close enough to the awaken.

I mean for example comparing the the first in reverse order awaken heavy mdmg set.

you get set bonus wise
5% more pve dmg across the whole set and -5% pvp dmg taken.
10 more int, 5 more lck
25 more mcrit, 25 pts of acc
3% more mattack, 2% more dmg dealt
(then the best part about the gold is the 5% chance to increase their mdmg taken +5%)

then u compare it to the awaken
another 20 int and 10 lck
max mp 3896, 25 more mcrit and acc and 5% mcrit dmg
5% more mattack, 1% more dmg dealt and the proc becomes 10% chance with 2 stacks and a -252 acc debuff.

So as you can see theres nothing really standout that makes you unable to play the game with starting at the orange version and the second you get gold your more than capable to pvp on it without being at much of any disadvantage.

Idk if I'm missing something but I don't really think the system is unreasonable for brand new content?

I see, I didn't initially get how the armor upgrades work but that seems to be a good implementation for the newer players to get orange gear while they head towards the awakened set. Also, apologies but yeah, this same to be the main thread and it's in game discussions that I've heard regarding the number of materials needed.

If I understand this correctly, although the new patch has been out for only past a month, the number issue seems to have been acknowledged and will be addressed later on? If that's the situation right now, I don't see it as unreasonable but if you delay the changes to later on, the number of people who benefit from that future change would be little to none of the current player base. 

And to your point regarding the not-so-large difference between the gold and awakened sets, I see how the gap in stats isn't meant to separate the active and semi-active players but, in my eyes that means that the time it would take to awaken the sets shouldn't take months to do. Idk, it's hard to fully articulate my point and get it across but looking at the old lv70 awakened sets for example vs. the current sets, the old sets seemed to better represent "awakening" the sets through boss drops and npc interactions vs. flat out grinding for materials through chests you get from the dungeons. Although people did get annoyed as that single drop usually doesn't get to them as quickly as they want, it just made it more genuine and not appear "grindy".

Thank you though Jordan, I appreciate the response.

[Nanami]

17 hours ago, Jordan said:

I would agree with you, but the sets have only been out 1 month and 1 week. I have also checked the data on how many people have completed awaken sets and it is more of less in line with what was expected. I would argue anyone who is logging in now isn't even technically playing catch up?

That's the thing, everyone that currently has 1-2 sets awakened, I guarantee you they farmed majority if not all of the (168) essences before this patch even came out and that not a single person has awakened a set from this patch without having essences from before hand.
Many of the playerbase used to sell sets or essences, others farmed because abyss was quick so people had them ahead of time. 

17 hours ago, Jordan said:

So yes it takes maybe 1 month to awaken the armor and "max" it out.

Yes, it may take a month if you farm on 2-3 characters a day but why should we spend that long on a single set when there's 16 and to be geared we need at least 2-3 sets depending on the role we choose? A single character, I have many doubts that it will at all collect enough essences in a month to awaken a set. 

There's already too much to do as it is and everything takes a lot of time to farm/grind currently. There's things like Celestial Corridor and Angelic Temple/Demonic Fortress, that are still end-game content and take a while to even fill parties for currently. CC you can recruit for hours but unless you ask friends to go it's more than likely not going to fill. AT/DF is similar, HOO is dead because of accursed weapons. And even then, every single DGN is necessary or relevant still for some reason, be it gear or achievements.

All of them take 1 hour + to complete and most days 1-2h to recruit for, people just don't have this kind of time or motivation to spend between work/school for extreme grinds, 168 essences is far too many. Spending 1-3 months to grind for a single set just feels pointless, especially if 115 set is far cheaper and in some cases better than 125 awakened. 

I would really appreciate it if you can consider changing the amount necessary before it becomes "old content" or in 4-5 months, just give the remaining playerbase some kind of hope, motivation, and something to look forward to instead of bigger grinds, please and thank you.

[Jordan]

8 hours ago, Hops12 said:

And to your point regarding the not-so-large difference between the gold and awakened sets, I see how the gap in stats isn't meant to separate the active and semi-active players but, in my eyes that means that the time it would take to awaken the sets shouldn't take months to do. Idk, it's hard to fully articulate my point and get it across but looking at the old lv70 awakened sets for example vs. the current sets, the old sets seemed to better represent "awakening" the sets through boss drops and npc interactions vs. flat out grinding for materials through chests you get from the dungeons. Although people did get annoyed as that single drop usually doesn't get to them as quickly as they want, it just made it more genuine and not appear "grindy".

The old sets required players to do menial tasks that often times had little to no correlation with anything related to them. Armors specifically where worse because they where just grinding a 0/10 and hoping you get lucky and often times resulted in players buying every quest just to speed things up which doesn't really come across as interactive gameplay (Often times you had people just sitting at the end of a dungeon waiting for cooldowns to fall off to use the item again). Maybe people forget how bad the grind was back then before the shared party drop system gave everyone a summon item and back when the game wasn't so easy to just run 0/10 dungeons in 20 seconds. Also if you put bugs and abuse tricks a side these quests where honestly a lot worse on RNG side of things. I remember on official having to sell stones (due to the +13 +14 wipes they did) I had bought with real money to fortify my Awaken Grimoire because it took me around 24 days to get a single Felasky who didn't even drop the item when i killed it.

I'm not trying to argue what is the best in the community eyes but from just outright looking at the game since I introduced material based systems for gear. The player engagement has gone up significantly and patch longevity has also increased. I have made tons of content over the years and the content that is the most engaging and stands the test of time is anything with materials involved. Starting with stuff like GOP / DS and including things like HoO / Abyss. I'm sure everyone would love content that takes a week to get everything you wanted from it but if we want to keep the game active between patches this is the only way that I've found success.

7 hours ago, Nanami said:

That's the thing, everyone that currently has 1-2 sets awakened, I guarantee you they farmed majority if not all of the (168) essences before this patch even came out and that not a single person has awakened a set from this patch without having essences from before hand.
Many of the playerbase used to sell sets or essences, others farmed because abyss was quick so people had them ahead of time.

Already said I would look into it didn't I?

 

[banluysrul]

really really thank you GM Jordan and all staffs. for Eden vendetta. we love it . for me I'm stay online 20h to 27h per day. so I'm really understand every things happen in game. people play on different time soon. so that is the problem. when the seller abyss mats online the buyer offline. and some rich player have buy collect all abyss and deep abyss mats. so player not online same time cant buy it. example rich player they don't play any abyss just sit at Aven and can awaken from 2 to 4 set. awaken set hard yeah that is true for player that played only character . but for old player can awaken 2 set . for old player that not sell abyss mats.  for me i think every content have connection. like newbie can make 1 evil set just 9+9 mats easy . and awaken set 125 demonic only stack -resist with abyss evil and awaken 110. but demonic not awaken not stack. and I see some newbie he really understand the game they just go do trail 110 for make awaken set 110 for playing abyss all days.  at the end I'm mean if player newbies have been read the content and guide not hard for them . EE vendetta have been give the best gift option for all newbie and old player to play . so don't force to complete fast content update. because there are nothing to do if we complete it. example AT And DF .

thank a lots to all player newbies and old player and just come back to play. hope every enjoy fun together having fun on game . if newbies don't know how fast geared just sell VGN a round 30$ u can have set and geared fast. if u don't wanna Sell VGN just create 2 account 1 for Maint and other one for keep company Pt also free buff and couple buff. just farm 1 month enough can buy set .

hope every one kindly to understand and keep have fun on game ...

 

[Hoshino]

Greetings,

I wanted to share some insights on certain aspects of the game that have been around since the latest patch. Some of my suggestions have already been brought up in this thread, yet I would still like to emphasize their importance, aiming to prioritize and ensure this issue is acknowledged for further investigation. I'd like to offer these observations as suggestions for consideration. Please forgive any grammatical errors in this post.

 

Abyss:

Regarding the making of the Lv125 Awaken Sets, as previously mentioned, the current main issue is the significant amount of normal abyss essences required (168) to craft the set, particularly the quantity needed to enhance and craft the new awaken tablets (90). In optimal scenarios, we get around 3-4 normal essences daily, considering both monster drops and abyss bags sent to mail. In less favorable situations, which are more common, we typically 0-2 essences, mostly from bags only, which in my opinion, are more reliable. This suggests that the monster drop rate for these essences is disproportionately low given the amount required to create a new set from scratch. In contrast of Deep Abyss, where the new essences can drop both the 1st and 2nd boss forms, Regular Abyss provides only one instance/chance for this. Additionally, there is a chance for x2 essence drops in Deep Abyss.

My suggestion to this would be to possibly:

• Increase the drop rates of the regular abyss essences, at least from the bosses.
• Substantially reduce the number of essences needed to create the awaken tablets (90 -> 60 would be a reasonable adjustment).

In the current state of the game, it would take several months for an individual person to farm all the necessary items just for one single set. Achieving this in one month is overly optimistic, relying on exceptionally lucky essence and soul drop rates, and multiple daily farming sessions, which may not be feasible for everyone, especially for new players with limited characters and lacking a dedicated group of friends or a set party.

Naturally, the viability of these suggestions may differ based on the experience of each person. While some players may have pre-farmed all the normal essences needed and chose to directly awaken the armor sets, their data does not accurately represent the grind and consistency required for someone new or trying to catch up. 

Partial Enchantments:

I heavily agree with the changes proposed above. If reducing the number of abyssal souls is not feasible (though a reduction from 60 -> 45-50 would be fair), a viable improvement would be to allow them to drop naturally from the Deep Abyss bosses, similar to the 110 Trial bosses that drop Lv8 Enchant boxes.

 

While slightly deviating from the main topic, similar to the feedback provided in this thread, I would appreciate a review of previously proposed suggestions such as CC, HoO (already old content), QoL related posts, etc. Some of these suggestions may have received approval for consideration but appear to have been unintentionally overlooked for a very long time. I believe that most of these suggestions would greatly enhance the overall gameplay enjoyment and serve to motivate players to engage for longer periods of time, assuming that it aligns with the intended objectives of the recent patches.

Thank you for your time to read my response. Have a nice day~